Re: Fw: US Politics: Competitive Bidding for Prosthetics
Justin Foster
Description
Collection
Title:
Re: Fw: US Politics: Competitive Bidding for Prosthetics
Creator:
Justin Foster
Date:
9/23/2002
Text:
List-
If our patients would accept some of the financial burden, and quit
expecting insurance to cover the latest and greatest in prosthetic (and
orthotic for that matter) care, then we wouldnt have this problem. Then
normal business/market pricing could be bourne out. If I want to have a
hi-end bicycle, or a great pair of skiis, I have to pay for it... how can we
continue to expect insurance to pay for $1500 liners, flex feet, and
computer controlled knee joints??? Maybe this is why payors are going
bankrupt! I understand the medical need for a prosthesis or orthosis, but I
believe we have overstepped our bounds again and again on what is medically
necessary for our patients (often really clients) Take a look at what
people are walking on in other countries... Let's take off the kid-gloves
and handle our patients like any other responsible consumer; we survive,
manufacturer R&D can continue just like other industries, patients have a
greater interest in products available... etc!!! Everybody wins!
Justin Foster
Prosthetic Resident
CIRS Palo Alto
>From: Anthony T. Barr < <Email Address Redacted> >
>Reply-To: <Email Address Redacted>
>To: <Email Address Redacted>
>Subject: Re: [OANDP-L] Fw: US Politics: Competitive Bidding for Prosthetics
>Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2002 09:27:45 -0400
>
>As a subscriber and periodic participant of both the AMP-L and the OANDP- L
>listserves, I find it interesting that practitioners seem more willing to
>speak their minds on the media used primarily for amputees than that of
>the more often monitored listserve utilized by their fellow colleagues and
>the manufacturers.
>
>Michael Freeman really gets to the meat of the problem, lack of
>affordability and greed.
>Excessive markups of prosthetic components and supplies.
>
>I am told that since practitioners cannot be properly reimbursed from the
>current established L code structure for each O&P service performed to
>make
>a reasonable profit, they must inflate certain areas to the maximum in
>order to make up for other reimbursement levels for some schedule
>categories
>that are not appropriate under the current system.
>Manufactures can charge what ever the market can bear.
>
>Certainly R& D factors should be properly equated into
>manufacture/practitioner and consumer pricing but not for an indefinite
>period of time which would preclude affordability to patients.
>
>The practitioner is often and unfairly targeted as the culprit of greed
>when
>he may not have a choice in charging excessive markups for some of the
>components he uses in order to make a reasonable profit.
>
>Perhaps the current L-code system requires an overhaul and re-evaluation to
>gain fairness integrity and honesty back in the system.
>
>My impression is what we are talking about here is excessive markups from
>the cost of manufacturing to the sale to the provider, to the cost of
>delivery of these services to third party payers.
>
>Manufacturers and providers use interchangeably the words of consumer and
>patient to fit there needs.
>They sell services and products to consumers, if they want to avoid
>mantatory professional educational qualifications, regulation and price
>fixing , but use patients to warrant costs justified by R&D, hi-tech
>technology components and delivery of highly specialized health care
>services.
>
>You can't have it both ways.Or can you!
>Feel free to cc your comments to the O&P Listserve as well !
>
>Tony Barr
>
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: michael freeman < <Email Address Redacted> >
>To: Amputee Information Network < <Email Address Redacted> >
>Sent: Thursday, September 19, 2002 12:26 AM
>Subject: Re: Fw: US Politics: Competitive Bidding for Prosthetics
>
>
> > If there was only one lawyer in town they'd starve.
> > I support amputation in or around the neck area....
> >
> > There are 3 parts to the 1974-78 consumer protection laws (federal)
> > the worst is the doctrine of strict liability.
> > It basically says,... if you know of, or should have know of because of
> > your professional standing in the industry, that through the products
>use
> > misuse or abuse that it will cause injury to person or property, then
>the
> > consumer must be notified of such in writing before the purchase other
>wise
> > they are guilty of failure to warn, there is no defense and the
>government
> > will be the lawyer against you....
> > This does not instill in any manufacture or person the desire to venture
> > into maybe's
> > I know that in my case (used equipment) I am so hard on the stuff it
>breaks
> > early compared to others. If some of my old stuff were to be reused,
>.....
> > well no way.
> > We need to address the RAPE of the prices charged! I know from my own
> > business that a 2.5 to 3.5 times material cost is needed to survive in
>the
> > market place... BUT I don't support 5 to 7 times costs for any reason.
> > Most alpha liners cost the CPs $250.00 (less lock). To sell them for
> > $500.00 to $750.00 is in the ball park. But I know of several cases
>where
> > the bill was over $1500.00 for a single liner, no services, no
> > fitting. Also the cost that Alpha charges for the liner to the CP is
>out
> > of line, even with R&D costs rolled in. Maximum cost is $50.00 to
>$65.00
> > at 3x times that would be $150 to $165.00.
> > I think the O&P industry needs to take a look at it's self and get in
>line
> > with the real world and not try to make the JAG payment on each customer
> > that comes in.
> > michael
> >
>
> ********************
>To unsubscribe, send a message to: <Email Address Redacted> with
>the words UNSUB OANDP-L in the body of the
>message.
>
>If you have a problem unsubscribing,or have other
>questions, send e-mail to the moderator
>Paul E. Prusakowski,CPO at <Email Address Redacted>
>
>OANDP-L is a forum for the discussion of topics
>related to Orthotics and Prosthetics.
>
>Public commercial postings are forbidden. Responses to inquiries
>should not be sent to the entire oandp-l list. Professional credentials
>or affilliations should be used in all communications.
_________________________________________________________________
Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: <URL Redacted>
********************
To unsubscribe, send a message to: <Email Address Redacted> with
the words UNSUB OANDP-L in the body of the
message.
If you have a problem unsubscribing,or have other
questions, send e-mail to the moderator
Paul E. Prusakowski,CPO at <Email Address Redacted>
OANDP-L is a forum for the discussion of topics
related to Orthotics and Prosthetics.
Public commercial postings are forbidden. Responses to inquiries
should not be sent to the entire oandp-l list. Professional credentials
or affilliations should be used in all communications.
If our patients would accept some of the financial burden, and quit
expecting insurance to cover the latest and greatest in prosthetic (and
orthotic for that matter) care, then we wouldnt have this problem. Then
normal business/market pricing could be bourne out. If I want to have a
hi-end bicycle, or a great pair of skiis, I have to pay for it... how can we
continue to expect insurance to pay for $1500 liners, flex feet, and
computer controlled knee joints??? Maybe this is why payors are going
bankrupt! I understand the medical need for a prosthesis or orthosis, but I
believe we have overstepped our bounds again and again on what is medically
necessary for our patients (often really clients) Take a look at what
people are walking on in other countries... Let's take off the kid-gloves
and handle our patients like any other responsible consumer; we survive,
manufacturer R&D can continue just like other industries, patients have a
greater interest in products available... etc!!! Everybody wins!
Justin Foster
Prosthetic Resident
CIRS Palo Alto
>From: Anthony T. Barr < <Email Address Redacted> >
>Reply-To: <Email Address Redacted>
>To: <Email Address Redacted>
>Subject: Re: [OANDP-L] Fw: US Politics: Competitive Bidding for Prosthetics
>Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2002 09:27:45 -0400
>
>As a subscriber and periodic participant of both the AMP-L and the OANDP- L
>listserves, I find it interesting that practitioners seem more willing to
>speak their minds on the media used primarily for amputees than that of
>the more often monitored listserve utilized by their fellow colleagues and
>the manufacturers.
>
>Michael Freeman really gets to the meat of the problem, lack of
>affordability and greed.
>Excessive markups of prosthetic components and supplies.
>
>I am told that since practitioners cannot be properly reimbursed from the
>current established L code structure for each O&P service performed to
>make
>a reasonable profit, they must inflate certain areas to the maximum in
>order to make up for other reimbursement levels for some schedule
>categories
>that are not appropriate under the current system.
>Manufactures can charge what ever the market can bear.
>
>Certainly R& D factors should be properly equated into
>manufacture/practitioner and consumer pricing but not for an indefinite
>period of time which would preclude affordability to patients.
>
>The practitioner is often and unfairly targeted as the culprit of greed
>when
>he may not have a choice in charging excessive markups for some of the
>components he uses in order to make a reasonable profit.
>
>Perhaps the current L-code system requires an overhaul and re-evaluation to
>gain fairness integrity and honesty back in the system.
>
>My impression is what we are talking about here is excessive markups from
>the cost of manufacturing to the sale to the provider, to the cost of
>delivery of these services to third party payers.
>
>Manufacturers and providers use interchangeably the words of consumer and
>patient to fit there needs.
>They sell services and products to consumers, if they want to avoid
>mantatory professional educational qualifications, regulation and price
>fixing , but use patients to warrant costs justified by R&D, hi-tech
>technology components and delivery of highly specialized health care
>services.
>
>You can't have it both ways.Or can you!
>Feel free to cc your comments to the O&P Listserve as well !
>
>Tony Barr
>
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: michael freeman < <Email Address Redacted> >
>To: Amputee Information Network < <Email Address Redacted> >
>Sent: Thursday, September 19, 2002 12:26 AM
>Subject: Re: Fw: US Politics: Competitive Bidding for Prosthetics
>
>
> > If there was only one lawyer in town they'd starve.
> > I support amputation in or around the neck area....
> >
> > There are 3 parts to the 1974-78 consumer protection laws (federal)
> > the worst is the doctrine of strict liability.
> > It basically says,... if you know of, or should have know of because of
> > your professional standing in the industry, that through the products
>use
> > misuse or abuse that it will cause injury to person or property, then
>the
> > consumer must be notified of such in writing before the purchase other
>wise
> > they are guilty of failure to warn, there is no defense and the
>government
> > will be the lawyer against you....
> > This does not instill in any manufacture or person the desire to venture
> > into maybe's
> > I know that in my case (used equipment) I am so hard on the stuff it
>breaks
> > early compared to others. If some of my old stuff were to be reused,
>.....
> > well no way.
> > We need to address the RAPE of the prices charged! I know from my own
> > business that a 2.5 to 3.5 times material cost is needed to survive in
>the
> > market place... BUT I don't support 5 to 7 times costs for any reason.
> > Most alpha liners cost the CPs $250.00 (less lock). To sell them for
> > $500.00 to $750.00 is in the ball park. But I know of several cases
>where
> > the bill was over $1500.00 for a single liner, no services, no
> > fitting. Also the cost that Alpha charges for the liner to the CP is
>out
> > of line, even with R&D costs rolled in. Maximum cost is $50.00 to
>$65.00
> > at 3x times that would be $150 to $165.00.
> > I think the O&P industry needs to take a look at it's self and get in
>line
> > with the real world and not try to make the JAG payment on each customer
> > that comes in.
> > michael
> >
>
> ********************
>To unsubscribe, send a message to: <Email Address Redacted> with
>the words UNSUB OANDP-L in the body of the
>message.
>
>If you have a problem unsubscribing,or have other
>questions, send e-mail to the moderator
>Paul E. Prusakowski,CPO at <Email Address Redacted>
>
>OANDP-L is a forum for the discussion of topics
>related to Orthotics and Prosthetics.
>
>Public commercial postings are forbidden. Responses to inquiries
>should not be sent to the entire oandp-l list. Professional credentials
>or affilliations should be used in all communications.
_________________________________________________________________
Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: <URL Redacted>
********************
To unsubscribe, send a message to: <Email Address Redacted> with
the words UNSUB OANDP-L in the body of the
message.
If you have a problem unsubscribing,or have other
questions, send e-mail to the moderator
Paul E. Prusakowski,CPO at <Email Address Redacted>
OANDP-L is a forum for the discussion of topics
related to Orthotics and Prosthetics.
Public commercial postings are forbidden. Responses to inquiries
should not be sent to the entire oandp-l list. Professional credentials
or affilliations should be used in all communications.
Citation
Justin Foster, “Re: Fw: US Politics: Competitive Bidding for Prosthetics,” Digital Resource Foundation for Orthotics and Prosthetics, accessed November 25, 2024, https://library.drfop.org/items/show/219604.
