REPLIES: SHOES
Joan K. Cestaro
Description
Collection
Title:
REPLIES: SHOES
Creator:
Joan K. Cestaro
Date:
4/29/2002
Text:
Thank you to everyone who responded. My list of responses follows my
original post.
We recently sent one of our long-term technicians to school for
pedorthics and will have him take over the majority of our shoe related
services. We will enact some changes to our recent policy for providing
shoes through Medicare's Therapeutic Shoe Bill. We currently have a
pretty open policy and as we all know, this is such a huge money loser.
Many facilities do not even offer this service anymore. The only way to
actually turn a profit with these meager reimbursements is to stock an
inexpensive black shoe. We have been looking at many different styles
trying to find one that meet the needs of the majority of our patients.
We currently use PW Minor shoes and they are about double the cost of
some others on the market.
We are not looking for the cheapest available, but would like a cheaper
alternative to PW Minor. The ACOR line of off the shelf shoes are the
ones we like the best so far. They have triple inserts for added depth
and a great toe box shape. They are pretty basic in styling and should
be cosmetically acceptable to most patients. What style of orthopedic
off the shelf shoes are you using and (most importantly) WHY DID YOUR
FACILITY CHOOSE THAT PARTICULAR SHOE? I am most interested in the WHY
part of this question. Thanks in advance.
RESPONSES:
DREW HAS THE NEW ETONIC TENNIS SHOE VERY COMPETITIVE $ AND IS A DEPTH
SHOE
COMES IN BLACK WHITE AND VELCRO/LACE UP.....DOWN SIDE RUNS A BIT SMALL
.....PRICE WAS THE TOP REASON FOR US.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
-
We have been using Sequoia Comfort-Rite shoes for our Medicare pedorthic
clients for about 3 years now. They tend to run a little smaller than
the Minor shoes in the same sizes. Our main reason for using them is
that the cost is more reasonable. They are about as cosmetic as ACOR.
They have a
double-depth style for men and women in the event of this need. When
we
look at the real job cost to provide a pair of shoes, (time for sizing,
ordering, fitting, adjustments, billing, AR) we have come to the
conclusion it is more cost efficient to just give them away; and we may
just do that. Just think, no hard copy documentation for billing
purposes. It will save a lot of space.
--------------------------------------------
I am using the ACOR urban walkers for the reason you mention. I only use
PW Minors when I need to use their super depth style to accomodate a
charcot foot and then I usually don't accept assignment. I am convinced
that every shoe PW Minor ever made slips on the heel. The ACOR shoes
actually fit most people better and I find despite their lower cost most
people are more satisfied with them. I am beginning to use some of the
shoes made by PROPET. A couple of the shoes work well for metal bracing
and one style is identical to the SAS Free time/Time Out. These shoes
range from 25 to 30 bucks a pair. They have another design which is
similar to Pedors but the construction is better and the cost is the
same - 40 bucks. The best thing is to explain to patients that the shoes
serve a medical purpose and that is the primary concern in their design.
I also provide them with VERY limited choices for this reason. I don't
make any bones about telling them that the reimbursement on shoes is
limited. When this is explained in a friendly and diplomatic manner, the
patient's are usually more than willing to cooperate. Almost no one
including the Docs expects you to lose money. I let the few who do go
and pay my competition a visit :)
------------------------------
I use the PW Minor Canfields line...$48.women $58. men...I think I make
enough off them and can still sell a quality MADE in USA product...the
stretch great if needed hold up well...and take Alimed's FOs..and I can
Establish an account with them when I need a super d shoe. Also I run
my shoes like a shoe store...non assignment...they pay me and then they
receive their check from Medicare within three to four weeks... that way
I can charge enough and they receive a portion back...and If they want a
different shoe I have collected for it before and explain to them that
they will receive $126 from Medicare and $64 for the inlays...I price my
Canfields $ 144 for Women and $174 for men's and discount off from there
if they pay first...FOs are $125 for two pairs Modified off the shelf
and $125 each for custom and I collect it without a problem...Think
retail not medical for shoes...take care...
-------------------------------------
Apex Ambulators B2000 type. Not the old, clunky, velcro tongue model
you might think it is. The tongue is sewn in, and the shoe is certainly
presentable; may not be as sylish as the Minors but it's only $64/pair.
Triple inserts as well. So really 3 reasons why I use them: reasonable
cosmesis, price, and triple inserts.
---------------------------
We have in the past shared the same concerns regarding shoes. We have
an Orthotic product evaluation committee that accesses product lines (it
helps take the pressure off me). We accessed a variety of shoe
companies. We ended up stocking APEX shoes. At the time we also looked
to our 2 Cpeds for their recommendations. We are able to fit
approximately 95% of our patients (28 facilities) with Apex shoes. We
still do purchase for PW Minor when necessary do to last type or
previous wear. This has been much more cost effective. Hope this
helps.
--------------------------------------------
APIS shoe number is (888) 937-2747. They are located here in the Los
Angeles
area. They have been in the commercial shoe business for many years,
but
have only recently gotten into O&P.
-----------------------------------------
I have used the Apex Biomechanical ambulator shoes in the past, but
stopped using them because they have too much heel height for many of
the elderly. The new Ariya is a 3/8 heel height with same
characteristics as the older style with a 3/4 heel height. This seems
to be a well built shoe with good longevity. The new Ariya has an
oblique toe box which is not as appealing to some people but is a good
fit.
The other shoe is the Acor line. This is a very flexible shoe, much like
a tennis shoe and has held up to hard wear for most of our patients.
This lacing system is unique and effective.
These are the standard lines of shoes we use because of the quality,
the fit, and the price. If these are not appropriate, then we use either
PW Minor or Drew. I am partial to Drew because it has a lower heel
height on most of their styles. The Drew are well built shoes and very
consistent in sizing. They have standard orthopedic depth and double
depth in various styles. I like the wider heel contact area on the Drew
better than the PW Minor also.
Another advantage to the Acor and Apex shoes is that they are available
through Cascade O & P Supply. They will ship (or drop ship) next day air
same as ground price. This means we have quick access without large in
house stocking.
----------------------------------------------------------------
Check out Drew Shoes, they have a nice selection in the lower $40
range.
-----------------------------------------------
PW Minor has some new shoes that are copies of the SAS styles. They are
called Leisure (womens) and Leisure TIme (Men's). They aren't as good
as the SAS styles but they put the APEX and ACOR styles to shame because
they fit much better. They are available in ties and velcro styles.
Call you Minor rep
original post.
We recently sent one of our long-term technicians to school for
pedorthics and will have him take over the majority of our shoe related
services. We will enact some changes to our recent policy for providing
shoes through Medicare's Therapeutic Shoe Bill. We currently have a
pretty open policy and as we all know, this is such a huge money loser.
Many facilities do not even offer this service anymore. The only way to
actually turn a profit with these meager reimbursements is to stock an
inexpensive black shoe. We have been looking at many different styles
trying to find one that meet the needs of the majority of our patients.
We currently use PW Minor shoes and they are about double the cost of
some others on the market.
We are not looking for the cheapest available, but would like a cheaper
alternative to PW Minor. The ACOR line of off the shelf shoes are the
ones we like the best so far. They have triple inserts for added depth
and a great toe box shape. They are pretty basic in styling and should
be cosmetically acceptable to most patients. What style of orthopedic
off the shelf shoes are you using and (most importantly) WHY DID YOUR
FACILITY CHOOSE THAT PARTICULAR SHOE? I am most interested in the WHY
part of this question. Thanks in advance.
RESPONSES:
DREW HAS THE NEW ETONIC TENNIS SHOE VERY COMPETITIVE $ AND IS A DEPTH
SHOE
COMES IN BLACK WHITE AND VELCRO/LACE UP.....DOWN SIDE RUNS A BIT SMALL
.....PRICE WAS THE TOP REASON FOR US.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
-
We have been using Sequoia Comfort-Rite shoes for our Medicare pedorthic
clients for about 3 years now. They tend to run a little smaller than
the Minor shoes in the same sizes. Our main reason for using them is
that the cost is more reasonable. They are about as cosmetic as ACOR.
They have a
double-depth style for men and women in the event of this need. When
we
look at the real job cost to provide a pair of shoes, (time for sizing,
ordering, fitting, adjustments, billing, AR) we have come to the
conclusion it is more cost efficient to just give them away; and we may
just do that. Just think, no hard copy documentation for billing
purposes. It will save a lot of space.
--------------------------------------------
I am using the ACOR urban walkers for the reason you mention. I only use
PW Minors when I need to use their super depth style to accomodate a
charcot foot and then I usually don't accept assignment. I am convinced
that every shoe PW Minor ever made slips on the heel. The ACOR shoes
actually fit most people better and I find despite their lower cost most
people are more satisfied with them. I am beginning to use some of the
shoes made by PROPET. A couple of the shoes work well for metal bracing
and one style is identical to the SAS Free time/Time Out. These shoes
range from 25 to 30 bucks a pair. They have another design which is
similar to Pedors but the construction is better and the cost is the
same - 40 bucks. The best thing is to explain to patients that the shoes
serve a medical purpose and that is the primary concern in their design.
I also provide them with VERY limited choices for this reason. I don't
make any bones about telling them that the reimbursement on shoes is
limited. When this is explained in a friendly and diplomatic manner, the
patient's are usually more than willing to cooperate. Almost no one
including the Docs expects you to lose money. I let the few who do go
and pay my competition a visit :)
------------------------------
I use the PW Minor Canfields line...$48.women $58. men...I think I make
enough off them and can still sell a quality MADE in USA product...the
stretch great if needed hold up well...and take Alimed's FOs..and I can
Establish an account with them when I need a super d shoe. Also I run
my shoes like a shoe store...non assignment...they pay me and then they
receive their check from Medicare within three to four weeks... that way
I can charge enough and they receive a portion back...and If they want a
different shoe I have collected for it before and explain to them that
they will receive $126 from Medicare and $64 for the inlays...I price my
Canfields $ 144 for Women and $174 for men's and discount off from there
if they pay first...FOs are $125 for two pairs Modified off the shelf
and $125 each for custom and I collect it without a problem...Think
retail not medical for shoes...take care...
-------------------------------------
Apex Ambulators B2000 type. Not the old, clunky, velcro tongue model
you might think it is. The tongue is sewn in, and the shoe is certainly
presentable; may not be as sylish as the Minors but it's only $64/pair.
Triple inserts as well. So really 3 reasons why I use them: reasonable
cosmesis, price, and triple inserts.
---------------------------
We have in the past shared the same concerns regarding shoes. We have
an Orthotic product evaluation committee that accesses product lines (it
helps take the pressure off me). We accessed a variety of shoe
companies. We ended up stocking APEX shoes. At the time we also looked
to our 2 Cpeds for their recommendations. We are able to fit
approximately 95% of our patients (28 facilities) with Apex shoes. We
still do purchase for PW Minor when necessary do to last type or
previous wear. This has been much more cost effective. Hope this
helps.
--------------------------------------------
APIS shoe number is (888) 937-2747. They are located here in the Los
Angeles
area. They have been in the commercial shoe business for many years,
but
have only recently gotten into O&P.
-----------------------------------------
I have used the Apex Biomechanical ambulator shoes in the past, but
stopped using them because they have too much heel height for many of
the elderly. The new Ariya is a 3/8 heel height with same
characteristics as the older style with a 3/4 heel height. This seems
to be a well built shoe with good longevity. The new Ariya has an
oblique toe box which is not as appealing to some people but is a good
fit.
The other shoe is the Acor line. This is a very flexible shoe, much like
a tennis shoe and has held up to hard wear for most of our patients.
This lacing system is unique and effective.
These are the standard lines of shoes we use because of the quality,
the fit, and the price. If these are not appropriate, then we use either
PW Minor or Drew. I am partial to Drew because it has a lower heel
height on most of their styles. The Drew are well built shoes and very
consistent in sizing. They have standard orthopedic depth and double
depth in various styles. I like the wider heel contact area on the Drew
better than the PW Minor also.
Another advantage to the Acor and Apex shoes is that they are available
through Cascade O & P Supply. They will ship (or drop ship) next day air
same as ground price. This means we have quick access without large in
house stocking.
----------------------------------------------------------------
Check out Drew Shoes, they have a nice selection in the lower $40
range.
-----------------------------------------------
PW Minor has some new shoes that are copies of the SAS styles. They are
called Leisure (womens) and Leisure TIme (Men's). They aren't as good
as the SAS styles but they put the APEX and ACOR styles to shame because
they fit much better. They are available in ties and velcro styles.
Call you Minor rep
Citation
Joan K. Cestaro, “REPLIES: SHOES,” Digital Resource Foundation for Orthotics and Prosthetics, accessed November 7, 2024, https://library.drfop.org/items/show/218903.
